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737NG Options for Lockheed Martin Prepar3D

 
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DaddyBooks



Joined: 21 Jun 2011
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:41 pm    Post subject: 737NG Options for Lockheed Martin Prepar3D Reply with quote

Folks...

I have been running a PMDG 737NGX environment with my JetMax setup. Unfortunatley, I have never been able to achieve a stable and reliable set-up with FSX and I'm at a crossroads.

I licensed Prepar3D some time ago and have found it to be a very stable environment with better support for my five (5) monitor set-up. Unfortunately, while I love the PMDG 737NGX, EULA restrictions don't permit me to use PMDG software on the P3D platform so I continue to endure FSX.

I'm now awaiting delivery of a JetMax 737 overhead and don't see much need to have a 2D or 3D cockpit within software much longer. As a result, I will likely abandon the very good PMDG product and am now researching options for a different flight and systems model for my JetMax set-up.

The most obvious option would appear to be the iFly 737 Pro Cockpit Builder's edition. However, that investment gets me almost half-way to a SSTD+ SIM-Avionics license which would seem to be the better long-term option for a hardware based flight deck.

Two questions please:

Firstly, I'm curious whether anyone here has insights regarding 737 options on P3D:
    iFly CBE -- anyone running with P3D?

    Sim-A -- since P3D does not include a 737 model, does anyone have suggestions regarding what 737 flight model could run within P3D with Sim-A as the avionics and systems logic engine?

    Are there others I should consider?
Secondly, PMDG has put significant effort into emulating the 737 systems and flight model to match the Boeing documentation but I can't compare that work to either Sim-A or iFly 737. Does anyone have a point-of-view about Sim-A or iFly's systems model compared to PMDG when used with a hardware cockpit.

I recognize this may be akin to asking someone about their political or religious opinions but thought I would ask this group of fine folks for their point-of-view.

Thanks in advance...

...Robert (aka DaddyBooks)
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Jetcos



Joined: 30 Sep 2005
Posts: 1118
Location: Newmarket,Ontario

PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In Prepar3d you can bring over the default B737 from FSX. If you run Sim-A there is a good (Tuned) flight model for Sim-A that you install for SIm-A. You still need the Default one there as it looks there for sounds and a panel.
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Steve Cos
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OmniAtlas



Joined: 06 Jul 2012
Posts: 124
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2013 9:28 pm    Post subject: Re: 737NG Options for Lockheed Martin Prepar3D Reply with quote

DaddyBooks wrote:


Sim-A -- since P3D does not include a 737 model, does anyone have suggestions regarding what 737 flight model could run within P3D with Sim-A as the avionics and systems logic engine?

Are there others I should consider?

...Robert (aka DaddyBooks)


Prosim737 http://prosim737.com/

Plug and play and extremely easy to setup. Compatible with most if not all hardware including FDS. They also have a a trial version.
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OmniAtlas



Joined: 06 Jul 2012
Posts: 124
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Edit. - I meant prosim has their own flight model on their web site. Unfortunately this is payware. However if you browse the forum there is Larry's model. I have merged the NGX flight dynamics with Larry's model and it works great. However I haven't done some serious testing and don't know if the plane is balanced with appropriate fuel on board.
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tkellogg



Joined: 25 Sep 2005
Posts: 227

PostPosted: Sat Nov 23, 2013 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaddyBooks,

I wouldn't give up on PMDG yet. Take a look at the recent post by the CEO of PMDG.

http://forum.avsim.net/topic/426627-a-few-notes-regarding-pmdgs-position-on-p3d-development/

I am more encouraraged by what he says here then anything I have read in the past. If I were a betting man I think the odds are in our favor that within six months PMDG products will be compatible with P3D Version 2.0 and not in violation of either companys EULA. It appears as if all the players are negotiating to make this a reality.

Tom Kellogg
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Tom Kellogg
Madison, Georgia USA
FlightSim 737NG
www.creativesimulations.com
kkellogg@bellsouth.net
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Garys



Joined: 09 Nov 2003
Posts: 164
Location: AB Canada

PostPosted: Sat Nov 23, 2013 5:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Although the thread is locked, what Tabs wrote in the second post, leads me to believe that PMDG position wont change. What I find very hypocritical about the whole subject in general is that even though FSX is an entertainment only platform, they know and even admit that professional pilots are using the products they sell as a tool for aircraft familiarization before job interviews and check rides. Not entertainment in the slightest. But this is another subject all together.

For us flightdeck builders, The Sim-Avionics, Project Magenta etc of this world is the best and IMO the only way to accomplish what it is we set out to achieve - A flight deck experience that only a multi million dollar sim can replicate.
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tkellogg



Joined: 25 Sep 2005
Posts: 227

PostPosted: Sat Nov 23, 2013 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Garys,

I have to disagree with you. PMDG has already indicated they will be working with P3D for professional flight simulation while stating this option will not be available to serious flight simmers for enternment. I think the issue that is holding up the availability of PMDG products for use with P3D has more to do with contracts between Boeing and PMDG than the EULA from LM. Obviously they are at least talking to each other. We can only hope
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Tom Kellogg
Madison, Georgia USA
FlightSim 737NG
www.creativesimulations.com
kkellogg@bellsouth.net
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Garys



Joined: 09 Nov 2003
Posts: 164
Location: AB Canada

PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 2:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A very similar post by Robert was made about 12-18 months ago.Those 5 large red X's told the story then and are still telling the story now. Despite saying that they were in discussions back then also, nothing has changed and Tabs strong post today about putting the company in jeopardy by breaking LM own rule says to me that it probably never will.

But as I said before, For what we a trying to achieve at the fraction of the price of a multi million $ simulator, The software packages with flight models that we have available are better suited to our needs anyhow.

Gary
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OmniAtlas



Joined: 06 Jul 2012
Posts: 124
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 9:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Garys wrote:
A very similar post by Robert was made about 12-18 months ago.Those 5 large red X's told the story then and are still telling the story now. Despite saying that they were in discussions back then also, nothing has changed and Tabs strong post today about putting the company in jeopardy by breaking LM own rule says to me that it probably never will.

But as I said before, For what we a trying to achieve at the fraction of the price of a multi million $ simulator, The software packages with flight models that we have available are better suited to our needs anyhow.

Gary


PMDG will be developing for P3D:

http://forum.avsim.net/topic/426978-pmdgs-p3d-development-status-fact-thread-updated-25nov13/
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tkellogg



Joined: 25 Sep 2005
Posts: 227

PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well what do you know? Even a blind dog finds a bone every now and then. Didn't think I would find one today? What a great year it's going to be.
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Tom Kellogg
Madison, Georgia USA
FlightSim 737NG
www.creativesimulations.com
kkellogg@bellsouth.net


Last edited by tkellogg on Mon Nov 25, 2013 4:54 am; edited 1 time in total
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Garys



Joined: 09 Nov 2003
Posts: 164
Location: AB Canada

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 12:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Other than to point fingers back at LM, it makes me wonder what the point of Tabs follow up post was actually about. Needless to say I'm pretty surprised considering the backwards and forwards that has taken place over the past 2 years. This definitely means one thing though, and that is the end of FSX.
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tkellogg



Joined: 25 Sep 2005
Posts: 227

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 4:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You gotta love free enterprise
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Tom Kellogg
Madison, Georgia USA
FlightSim 737NG
www.creativesimulations.com
kkellogg@bellsouth.net
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DaddyBooks



Joined: 21 Jun 2011
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have played Tom and Gary's discussion over and over again in my own mind in the past months. While not seeing a clear "No" from PMDG, the anticipated progress was not forthcoming.

Well...PMDG's timely announcement makes this much more interesting.

PMDG certainly appears to be a thoughtful and well managed commercial company. I have to believe they have cleared many of the contractural considerations given the confident posting of Robert Randazzo. With that, it looks like nothing is imminent but at least there appears a known future.

All of this also seems interestingly timed with the P3D 2.0 release. One might also think that the evolution of a more up to date framework (DirectX11, 64-bit modeling capable) will, in time, allow the add on makers with the richest content to expand their offerings.

What is also interesting is PMDG's apparent movement into providing licenses for Certified Training. Given the rigor they appear to put into their models, I always wondered if they had this in mind and it seems that is no longer a mystery. I would think this is a good harbinger for companies such as FDS that offer hardware of comparable quality.

If I should stay with PMDG, I would likely pilot a multi-channel environment in order to separate the environment graphics from the computer running the different display unit views although the cost of separately licensing P3D Professional licenses for multiple computers is a long-term consideration.

The other options here are all interesting. I will need to begin piloting (pun intended Wink) different software using the respective eval licenses. Sounds like good winter work while we are frozen indoors.

Thanks much for the continued insights...

...Robert (aka DaddyBooks)
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